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02729: Re: [WDDM] Chocolate minarets and Multikulti (for Hamid)

From: "Hamid" <esi1mohseni2(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2010 21:14:21 +0100
Subject: Re: [WDDM] Chocolate minarets and Multikulti (for Hamid)

I think it is not the right board for discussing this kind of subjects so if
you are interested to continue the discussion please use more private ways
Anyhow I could not resist to write a short answer to your arguments.

There are just and unjust fights. I support your fight in Warsaw Ghetto
because you had no other alternatives than fight for your survivance. I am
sorry that I can not support you fully in
your fight against your neighbours (Not Arabs because Arabs originate from
Saudi Arabian. Your neighbours talk Arabic and are muslims because they were
occupied and forced
to it by Saudi Arabian before) because of all unfair actions against them
before by Israelis and Western colonialists who support Israel by all
necessary means. I think Israelis are
also offer for Western colonial ambitions and are abused as a colonial base
in the region. Many Jews has been living more or less peacefully in Middle
East countries before.
Creation of Israel and Western colonial powers abuse of Israel has made it
almost impossible for jews to live in any other countries in middle east
than Israel.

In the case of Taliban I ask myself what did they get from West for their
support and fight against Russia but death, injuries and powerty. Perhaps
they found themselves lurked by West. We should also remember that it is not
Talibans who are in western territories and attacking West but they are in
their own countries and only defending themselves against occupants as you
did in Ghetto.

Regards
Hamid

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Georges Metanomski" <zgmet(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2010 1:21 PM
To: <wddm@world-wide-democracy.net>
Subject: RE: [WDDM] Chocolate minarets and Multikulti (for Hamid)

Hamid:
You say 60% of muslims request the recognition of sharia. I
wounder how realistic is these kind of statistics. You talk about
muslims as group but muslims are as christians individuals whith very
different opinions and understandings. Generalizations are most of the
time wrong and dangerous.
===============
G:
YES and NO.
In Warsaw Ghetto and subsequently in the occupied Poland I have been
several times saved by Nazi officials and even by an SS-man, so I
opposed putting all Germans, Nazis and even SS in one pot.

But when the SS marched into the Ghetto on the Passion Week 1943
in order to send the rest of inmates to gas, I joined the uprising
and was shooting at them as at a block.

In Haifa I have hundreds of Arab students and colleagues, all friends.
My wife exposed in the Arab Culture Center and our doctor was an
Arab. But these Arabs were normal, civilized people behaving like the
rest of Israelis and Western tourists, in sharp contrast with imported
thugs of Paris suburbs, whom the French, scared to enter their
neighborhoods, see as a block, as a rioting, criminal mob.

And, when, back in Israel, storming a school taken hostage, I saw
the terrorists as a block and left the floor to my M16.

Same, when Arab armies larger than the whole Israeli population
invaded Israel, tempting to exterminate it, I saw and fought them
as a block, even if a good percentage of Egyptian soldiers were
doubtless moderate and humane.

There is time for talking and time for fighting and we are,
unfortunately, facing the aggressive jihad, which leaves the floor
to arms. We should be magnanimous, once having won, like we were
with Germany and Japan, but talking and negotiating amidst the war
is tantamount to surrender. Yet, more and more things in heaven and
earth show that we are more likely to lose, than to win it.

Your historical analysis is good, but we have to face the concurrent
situation. It's true that the CIA has financed, armed and trained Taliban
mudjahadeen, so that they fight now Americans with American
arms and that Hamas has American sol-air missiles planned to be used
against commercial flights. Does it mean that we should not fight
Taliban and Hamas? No, it means that, while fighting them, we should
avoid similar idiocies in future.
====================
Hamid:
There is kind of humanity and love in poor and colonized countries which
you not find in western colonial countries.
======================
G:
A bit hasty. There are thousands of Korczaks, Father Kolbes, Abbe
Pierres in Europe.

Actually, I believe that we are nearly agreeing. The issue seems to
be 1.whether DD may arrange things and 2.how to get it.

I'm rather pessimistic.

As for 2. please read my
http://findgeorges.com/ROOT/WRITINGS/POLITICS/shadow_eng.html

As for 1. I fear that conditioned and manipulated masses are entirely
incapable of debating and learning and will always chose the loudest
rhetorician. In 1933, a supposed German DD would certainly vote for
Hitler. A feeble proof within our feeble WDDM: I suggested a DD
debate apprenticeship in my post "Direct Democracy" and there is not
even one answer.

Cheers
Georges.
=============


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