Re: [WDDM] Facets of Truth

[Antonio Rossin <rossin (at) tin.it>]

VPR, and others,

The difficulties WDDM faced these years, have not been overcome still.
These difficulties are still up, caused by some members who want to get
(direct) democracy being turned into a bureaucratic organization.

Anyway, their attempts to rule democracy by a bureaucratic board seem
to have revealed a flop, so late, because of the refusal of members inside
- and the member inside I dare say - to keep on being ruled by the usual
bureaucratic power-seekers' class.

That is, in reply to the question: "What the Hell is Democracy", I would
suggest Democracy is a society where the people (not the bureaucrats!)
have the first say --and   the last say, in respect of local laws.



Just my two cents,

antonio




Vijayaraghavan Padmanabhan ha scritto:
> Dear Bruce,
> Certainly I was not trying to get rid of anyone. I appreciate the
> difficulties faced by WDDM all these years to keep going. What I wish
> is that the WDDM should reach its goal successfully. We are all united
> in the spirit of true democracy; our apparent differences are only
> with regard to charting out the means.
>
> I feel that being an association would be advantageous to WDDM, rather
> than being an organization. The difference between the two is well
> described by Ben Clayson (found in the archives). An association of
> equals would be attractive to everyone to take part in the
> proceedings. In case we need to decide on a particular course of
> action every member can cast his vote with the assurance that his vote
> carries the same weightage as every other vote (isn't this an example
> of the spirit of Direct Democracy?).
>
> Having an organization of elected office bearers would make WDDM
> vulnerable to official action, in case it is perceived to be
> anti-establishment (this perception will be inevitable at some point
> of time). Being an internet based association where everyone is equal
> will make it immune to any such possibility. There is no need to
> register WDDM at all. The cost of maintaining the web-site can be met
> internally.
>
> I hope that my suggestions are taken in the right spirit. I am sorry
> if I have hurt the feelings of Mark, George and Nicole.
>
> PVR
>
>
> On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 Bruce Eggum wrote :
> > Dear PVR
> >
> > Unfortunately maybe, you missed the great damper of WDDM
> "discussions" which
> > kept it from even voting on how to vote. This was caused by various
> members
> > who seemed to want anarchy instead of democracy. Thus no "Charter" was
> > written/revised since the original which was incomplete.
> >
> > We also had "inactive" people who would turn up once a year or so, make
> > noise but never be around to make decisions. Quorum of members? That
> is why
> > we now have the first board. Please, they have hardly had time to
> meet and
> > you want to get rid of them?
> >
> > There must be organization  to an organization. This provides a
> system where
> > members can express themselves, make basic decisions for the group. The
> > group can than decide to endorse certain  methods or decide to
> advertise DD
> > to the people as a concept. Of course that means they must decide
> what DD is
> > first thus the need to discuss the matter and vote. How can "the
> group" take
> > on "the political space" if it is not united in it's definitions of
> DD? We
> > need to be able to define these things and post out "beliefs" on the
> website
> > with handouts, flyer's etc.
> >
> > We must allow the Board time to begin ,,,,,,, and than accomplish
> it's tasks
> > before we jump to other methods.
> >
> > Bruce
> >
> > On 3 Jun 2007 02:20:57 -0000, Vijayaraghavan Padmanabhan <
> > vijayaraghavan.p (at) rediffmail.com> wrote:
> > > Dear all,
> > > Everyone of us is unique and each one of our opinions is a facet of
> truth.
> > > Also each one of us has our predilections, our pet ideas. Nothing
> wrong with
> > > that since it forms the motivation for our action. About my
> suggestion for
> > > redefining DD, it was aimed at being action-oriented and taking on
> the world
> > > wide network of so-called democracy in the present form. I agree
> with Mirek
> > > that it represents only a intermediate stage in our final goal of True
> > > Democracy, however theoretical it may sound.
> > >
> > > Mark has declared that he is a stickler for constitutionalism. This is
> > > essential in an organization. But emphasis on this aspect in a group
> like
> > > WDDM would convert it into one more political party at a global
> level. We
> > > need a dynamic association to enter the political space instead of being
> > > bogged down by organizational matters.
> > >
> > > The current definition of DD is well expressed in initiatives like
> that of
> > > Nicole Durand, Echarp's variation of it, Roy Daine's myverdict, and the
> > > canadian initiative. Our in-built repulsion to authoritarianism and our
> > > earning for individual freedom is the basic motivation. But we need
> to keep
> > > the ultimate goal of taking on the political space while integrating
> these
> > > ideas into our mission since otherwise we will remain merely a
> discussion
> > > forum and nothing more. I think we should first decide on how we are
> going
> > > to take on the political parties on ground and check whether
> whatever we do
> > > is in line with this final goal.
> > >
> > > The very fact that only a handful of members are discussing
> indicates that
> > > presently WDDM is not attractive for open discussion. The formation
> of the
> > > executive board is a damper. Mirek's suggestion that it is meant for
> > > carrying out decisions made by members is appropriate. Since we are in a
> > > preliminary stage, may be the present board should be dissolved and
> a new
> > > board elected, if needed, in the future. The WDDM charter needs to be
> > > modified appropriately.
> > >
> > > PVR
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > -- Bruce Eggum
> > > > Gresham Wisconsin, USA
> > > > http://www.doinggovernment.com/
> > > > Check out my Blog too
> > > > http://bruceeggum.blogster.com/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >  vote