Our current legal system shows that big sets of rules that get passed as one unit are polluted with a myriad of riders designed to gain the support of special interests. A constitution is no different. If it is designed as one big chunk, we will have to make “compromises” to enlist the support of certain groups, and it will taint our new government.
If we define direct democracy as having no representatives, then we have a solid new term to use in our debate (what other definition could there be?). This is great, but if we are championing the form of government as the “best” without consulting the people who must be subject to it, then the term democracy is not appropriate to it.
Again, I don't think most of us are saying it is "the best". We have no proof of that. I think what frustrates most of us is that it never was, we don't know if it's the best or even good. It was never given a chance. It seems to me like it would be the fairest, the most evolved system of government, sure, but Direct democracy has to be tested in many different incarnations (with and without weighted voting, with and without compulsory participation, with and without universal initiative provisions, etc) before we can assess its effectiveness....
But what percentage of the population is interested in such experiments? As long as people have reasonable standards of living they will (the majority) choose to spend their time doing anything else, it doesn't matter what, just NOT this. The only situation that can reverse that is if people are in a desperate and immediate struggle to survive. We spend Billions supposedly bringing "democracy" to former dictatorships and we can't even be bothered to participate in our own. I'd like to think it's because it's NOT really a democracy and our desillusinment with it is what causes the low turnouts. But this is not the truth.
Look at reality. Look at the free choices people make, as consumers, as parents, etc. How far down their list of priorities is something like "Constitutional reform"? How many adults with serious careers, children, the whole nine yards have I met who told me to my face that they don't have any interest in politics, don't know the first thing about it, don't want to know and can we change the subject please... although the last month of last year's Presidential campaign was quite exciting... seeing all those people in Chicago was almost as good as watching Pop Idol. I'm not making any of this up. This is the average Western citizen, not some trailer park example. This apathy is the biggest obstacle to any of the ideas put forward in this forum.
To be a direct DEMOCRACY, it must be both DIRECT and CHOSEN by the people.
The best use of all the research that is being done here is to inform the public when they decide for themselves what course they wish to pursue. No one can predict what that will be, and the assumption that the best government can be guessed is pure hubris.
I can predict that if you phone people and ask them, the majority will tell you they are not interested in taking part in your "survey" or whatever you're selling.
I have gotten a lot more positive response from, “Would you like to choose for yourself?” than “Would you like to switch to [Insert form of government here]?”
Well, of course you have!!! Did you expect people to SAY "No, I prefer not to choose for myself, I am a sheep and I know it." ?
How can you draw any conclusions from that? How many of the people who SAID they would prefer to choose for themselves would even cross the street, IN ORDER to make those choices? Just like anything in life, talk is cheap. They won't lift a finger to make it happen.
Democracy must be the goal. It has never been tried. Not really.
Fully agree. Please forgive my negativity. I have faith in the concept of democracy. It's Western people I'm not so sure about. I think that an alternative democratic experiment would be very popular in North Korea, China or Cuba... but it would not be allowed.
Think BIG,
Parrhesia
PS… something to think on.
What a fine example of leadership you're giving us below. Don't worry, I've been accused of the same myself.
My point is that it will always take instigators, leaders, motivators...like you.
Welcome to Democracy
In each step, you will be choosing what role you wish government to play in your everyday life. Vote according to your preferences. In each step, there will be content and guidance provided by the organizations you have selected.
You have selected: WDDM and The Mises Instituteas your scholars. (Choose more here if you wish)
If these organizations provide video, text or other media for each decision, they will be made available at the appropriate times. You will also see the recommended choices of these scholars next to the options themselves.
Would you support
(choose all that apply)
X _ _ Anarchy, the complete absence of a compelling body of government.
XX X A system of government.
You chose a system of government. In proceeding, you may elect to make each decision
How
XX X Cooperate to design a democratic government from the ground up according to the preferences of society.
_ _ _ A new government designed by random representatives
_ _ _ The current government, in its existing form
_ _ _The current government, with some changes.
(This will preset all of the choices to the values currently
established by our government, which you can change)
Would you support
(choose all that apply)
Completely Representative Government
XX X Non-representative government
XX X Mixed government
For representation, do you prefer your representatives to
(choose all that apply)
_ _ X Pass binding laws (on areas you select)
_ _ X Make non-binding suggestions (on areas you select)
X _ X A Mix of the two
You said you would supported a government with mixed representation. What areas and what powers would you assign
None Suggestion (NSB)
NN N Military
NNS N Banking
NSBNS S Trade
…
Etcetera… you get the idea. From the decisions of the governed emerges real democracy… as socialist or free as the people wish. Do not attach freedom to democracy… do not attach capitalism or socialism or any other ism to it… make it the pure _expression_ of the public will and it will be beautiful.
Beautiful. Accept no less.