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02322: Re: [WDDM] Response to Hamid Mohseni

From: "Esi" <esi1mohseni2(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:16:03 +0200
Subject: Re: [WDDM] Response to Hamid Mohseni

Good evening Fred
Of course it is interesting from historical perpective to understand what
happenede before but it is not sure we can use all parts of this knowledge
for present time and future.
What hapened before hapened in dirfferent societiy relationships with
different technological possibilities. Our societies and individuals are
affected and changed a lot of new
technologies and can not be compare with old societies..
Anyhow if you or anybody else have any sources about the subject I am
interested to study.

Regards
Hamid .

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Fred Gohlke" <fredgohlke(at)verizon.net>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 2:50 PM
To: <wddm@world-wide-democracy.net>
Subject: [WDDM] Response to Hamid Mohseni

Good Morning, Hamid

re: "We should not forget that it is the present corrupt
democracies and diktator societies which gives enough
economicall and politicall power to few individuals and in
this way makes it possible for them to manipulate and
decieve peoiple by propaganda and other means."

I agree with you, but I would point out that it is even more important to
understand how and why the democracies deteriorated to their present
state. If we don't understand how it happened, we can't prevent a
recurrence.

The people are, indeed, manipulated and deceived. The work of B. F.
Skinner and the behavioral scientists lets our leaders (political and
commercial) milk us like cows ... and the growth of mass communications
has made their efforts inescapable. These people are very good at what
they do, and their success is the strongest argument against 'direct
democracy'.

If we are to defeat deception and manipulation we must find people who are
superior to the deceivers and manipulators. We have such people among us.
What we lack is a means of finding them and raising them to positions of
leadership.


re: "In proper functioning democracies it would be more difficult
for few people to manipulate others for their own interest
because the power is shared between bigge number of
individuals."

Of course, but what ... exactly ... is a 'proper functioning democracy'.
How is it organized? How does it work?

It is easy to say the people must make all the decisions. It is not as
easy to say how they should do so. Will you allow public officials? How
will they be selected? What will be their role?

Failure to consider these questions is what causes the huge gap between
the theory of democracy and its actual practice. It is precisely because
we have failed to consider these questions and provide sensible answers
for them that 'politicians' have been able to take control of our
governments.

Fred Gohlke


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